Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

william — Mon, 22 Dec 2008 07:17:07 GMT

would you recomend?for my maresany good sire they areby g slam el corredor and wheton

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

dz — Wed, 10 Dec 2008 02:47:39 GMT

When using Exchange Rate nicking with Buckpasser mare line the nick comes up with a c rating, yet it shows top performers with the cross throwing 5 seperate grade 1 winners. Why not a higher nick rating?

Alan's reply: Thank you for the question. Great topic -- so good that it deserves extra attention. Read the full response in Wednesday's blog post.

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

peter byrne — Sun, 07 Dec 2008 12:17:01 GMT

I love Trunicks but I am base in Ireland none of our stud farms here use you guys. I have mare, her name is Dubai Diamond she is by Octagonal out of a Nureyev mare.

Is he any good as a broodmare sire? His father is the great Zabeel. What line of sires would you recomend for her? She has 2005 Barathea colt foal..3 wins. 2006 filly by Elusive Quality and 2007 by Seeking the Gold. She has 2008 by Smart Strike. Has she any chance of producing top quality progeny?

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

Bill B — Thu, 04 Dec 2008 16:09:13 GMT

How does a rating go from a D to an a++ in a few months . As an exaample City Zip with a Prospectors Gamble mare. I realize Mr P to Mr P had something to do with it and maybe it just became good, but that is quite a jump. Your competitor still rataes it a D.

Alan's reply: Thank you for the question.

City Zip has had a remarkable run with Mr. Prospector line mares of late. Bustin Stones (dam by Prospectors Gamble) won the Carter on April 5, when he was already a stakes winner.

Partners Star (dam by Thunder Gulch) won the Anna M. Fisher Debutante Sakes on August 16.

Suzy Zip (dam by Distorted Humor) won the Elge Rasberry Stakes on August 30.

Citizen (dam by Seeking the Gold) won the Meadowlake Stakes on October 25.

So, from August 16 onward, City Zip added three new stakes winners out of Mr Prospector-line mares. His stakes production record with Mr. Prospector-line mares is superior to his percentage of stakes winners out all other mares, and the percentage of stakes winners produced by those mares when bred to all other stallions.

TrueNicks is designed to rapidly reflect such changes, obviously "the other program" is not!

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

brogers — Thu, 04 Dec 2008 02:31:15 GMT

Lindsay,

I just ran an unproven son of Storm Cat over a mare by a relatively unproven son of Storm Cat and the rating came back as a "D". There is certainly enough data to collect a result, it is just not a very good one!

If there was not enough data, the result would return "no rating". Basically what this "D" rating tells us is three things.

1) The chances of a horse bred on this cross being a stakes winner is rather small.

2) If you had a Storm Cat line mare, there are better stallions for you to breed to other than a Storm Cat line stallion

3) If you were managing a Storm Cat line stallion there are better broodmare sires to recommend than Storm Cat line mares.

Byron

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

lindsay gay — Thu, 04 Dec 2008 02:01:26 GMT

I USED YOUR TRUENICKS HYPOTHETICAL MATINGS AND NOTICED THAT CLOSE INBREEDING TO STORM CAT ( 2x3) RECEIVES A 'F' RATING .IS THIS BECAUSE YOU DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH DATA? PLEASE EXPLAIN.

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

Alan Porter — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 19:38:16 GMT

Hi CCB,

Inbreeding in certain positions can have a number of effects. Firstly, some genes are sex-linked (travel only on the x or y chromosome - the y carrying much more genetic material) and some have sex-linked impression (they are not passed on through the sex-chromosome, but are manifested in different ways depending on whether inherited via a male or a female - I believe Prader-Willi Syndrome in humans is one).

Also the positions of the inbreeding relative to other duplications can be important. For example, inbreeding to Northern Dancer might become an entirely different thing if through (for example) Storm Cat and Dehere, both Northern Dancer/Secretariat crosses.

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

CCB — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 03:40:03 GMT

I fail to see how inbreeding in certain positions can have any additional effect.....

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

danziggirl — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 03:29:08 GMT

And don't forget Storm Cat!

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

Phil L — Tue, 02 Dec 2008 01:09:58 GMT

In Texas Pulpits son Special Rate brings in two additional strains of Nasrullah through Indian Hemp and Nantallah. Special Rate being bred similarly Sky Mesa, it will be interesting to see his first crop, which are two year olds in 2009.

re: Line-breeding to Northern Dancer and Nasrullah in Thoroughbred Stallion Pedigrees

LanceS — Mon, 01 Dec 2008 17:03:49 GMT

That's an interesting point about Slew, since his best sire son, A.P. Indy brings in a third cross to Nasrullah (through a second cross to Bold Ruler), and Indy's best sire son to date, Pulpit, brings in two more crosses to Nasrullah, including a third cross to Bold Ruler. It's early, but the promising Sky Mesa brings in two more Nasrullah lines (for 7 total) and another Bold Ruler line (for 4 total). Tapit's dam, however, has no Nasrullah in her pedigree.